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Climate Change
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NY Times Strands
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• • • The Once-a-Day • • •
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Cryptic Posts - Leave Them Guessing
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USA! USA! USA!
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Derplahoma!
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Trump
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NYTimes Connections
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Wordle - daily game
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Things You Thought Today
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Music Videos
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Hockey + Fantasy Hockey
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Today in History
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China
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MTV's The Real World
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RightWingNutZ
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Breaking News
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Baseball, anyone?
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Little known information... maybe even facts
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How do you create optimism?
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favorite love songs
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Prog Rockers Anonymous
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The Dragons' Roost
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Dumb Laws
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BEATLES Make History AGAIN!!
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TV shows you watch
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Congress
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Song of the Day
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Photography Forum - Your Own Photos
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What did you have for dinner?
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Jam! (why should a song stop)
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June 2024 Photo Theme - Eyes
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Things I Saw Today...
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Some bands or songs are recurring too much in Rock channe...
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Fox Spews
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Sonos
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Name My Band
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Too much classic rock lately?
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Girls Just Want to Have Fun
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Musky Mythology
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Electronic Music
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Basketball
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Gotta Get Your Drink On
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Shall We Dance?
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Predictions
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Lyrics That Remind You of Someone
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Just Wrong
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Pink Floyd Set?
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Whatever happened to Taco Wagon?
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SCOTUS
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20+ year listeners?
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Hello from Greece!
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Europe
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What Are You Going To Do Today?
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What Did You See Today?
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Geomorphology
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Artificial Intelligence
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The Chomsky / Zinn Reader
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Index »
Radio Paradise/General »
General Discussion »
WikiLeaks
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Page: Previous 1, 2, 3 ... 52, 53, 54, 55, 56, 57 Next |
katzendogs
![katzendogs Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/19173-1519419907.jpg)
Location: Pasadena ,Texas Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Nov 30, 2010 - 4:36pm |
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musik_knut wrote:
*of course I would love to see the US get out of the UN and the UN out of the US...*
But where is a safe place? Guantanamo?
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katzendogs
![katzendogs Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/19173-1519419907.jpg)
Location: Pasadena ,Texas Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Nov 30, 2010 - 4:34pm |
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Manbird wrote:Share? Ewww. You can have the whole thing. ![](http://billivorylarson.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/lg_tab.jpg) Pepsi boyd. Pepsi.
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Manbird
![Manbird Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/25877-1407307273.jpg)
Location: La Villa Toscana Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Nov 30, 2010 - 4:32pm |
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When they start publishing CookiLeaks, I'm calling it quits.
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Manbird
![Manbird Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/25877-1407307273.jpg)
Location: La Villa Toscana Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Nov 30, 2010 - 4:30pm |
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katzendogs wrote:"share of that tab"
I sure could use some of that share. Share? Ewww. You can have the whole thing.
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musik_knut
![musik_knut Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/44453.gif)
Location: Third Stone From The Sun Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Nov 30, 2010 - 4:29pm |
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Monkeysdad wrote: Touched! And notice how no one in the EU blinked nor blanched when we stepped into The Balkans conflict; in their own backyard but why make a fuss when the global cops will pay the lions share of that tab.
If anyone should fuss, it should be the US taxpayer. With 190-something nations in the UN, the US pays about 23% of the tab. Where is the global barking about that? Ooops, more heavy lifting by Uncle Sugar... *of course I would love to see the US get out of the UN and the UN out of the US...*
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katzendogs
![katzendogs Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/19173-1519419907.jpg)
Location: Pasadena ,Texas Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Nov 30, 2010 - 4:27pm |
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"share of that tab"
I sure could use some of that share.
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Monkeysdad
![Monkeysdad Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/15754.jpg)
Location: Simi Valley, CA Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Nov 30, 2010 - 4:16pm |
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musik_knut wrote:
Of course the US plays global cop and sometimes justifably so. We are big enough to do what most others cannot do or will not do *logistically, materially and so on*. But there are many in the US, self included, who wonder why the cop role so often? For what it's worth, we had no business playing cop in Viet Nam *one of our greatest Generals, MacArthur, warned us not to get bogged down in a land war in Asia and of course, we did not learn from the lesson the French learned in Viet Nam*, nor did we have reason to enter Iraq *they were well contained and I do understand the potential nexus between Iraq, bioweapons and a willing proxy to use them*. For sure the US has many enemies.
Touched! And notice how no one in the EU blinked nor blanched when we stepped into The Balkans conflict; in their own backyard but why make a fuss when the global cops will pay the lions share of that tab.
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musik_knut
![musik_knut Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/44453.gif)
Location: Third Stone From The Sun Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Nov 30, 2010 - 4:12pm |
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Monkeysdad wrote: Touched! And notice how no one in the EU blinked nor blanched when we stepped into The Balkans conflict; in their own backyard but why make a fuss when the global cops will pay the lions share of that tab.
The Balkans is a prime example. For the second time in a little over 50 years, genocide was taking place in Europe. As time dragged on, Europe increasingly pestered Mr. Clinton to do something. When Mr. Clinton, along with others *after he stepped forward, of course* finally did, it was the right thing to do: stop Christian genocide against a Muslim population. But Europe, despite knowing what was the right thing to do, would not budge until the US led the way. Damned if we do, damned if we don't. And then we constantly get beat up for being the world's cop. Hrrrrrrrrumph! ![{#Wave} {#Wave}](scripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/img/icon_wave.gif) btw Md...howdy!
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Red_Dragon
![Red_Dragon Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/18168-1646400561.png)
Location: Dumbf*ckistan ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Nov 30, 2010 - 4:10pm |
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Monkeysdad wrote: Touched! And notice how no one in the EU blinked nor blanched when we stepped into The Balkans conflict; in their own backyard but why make a fuss when the global cops will pay the lions share of that tab.
Yet another example of Uncle Sam sticking his nose where it doesn't belong. I for one don't believe it is our job to be a "cop." I believe it is our job to mind our own damn business and stay the hell out of everyone elses. The primary reason there are people in the world who will blow themselves up to get a few of us is our own imperialist, interventionist foreign policy. The foreign policy that is quite frequently related to our bottomless thirst for oil in the name of economic progress. Why don't we focus our efforts on living within our means so that we don't need to exploit the rest of the world?
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Monkeysdad
![Monkeysdad Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/15754.jpg)
Location: Simi Valley, CA Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Nov 30, 2010 - 4:05pm |
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musik_knut wrote:
Of course the US plays global cop and sometimes justifably so. We are big enough to do what most others cannot do or will not do *logistically, materially and so on*. But there are many in the US, self included, who wonder why the cop role so often? For what it's worth, we had no business playing cop in Viet Nam *one of our greatest Generals, MacArthur, warned us not to get bogged down in a land war in Asia and of course, we did not learn from the lesson the French learned in Viet Nam*, nor did we have reason to enter Iraq *they were well contained and I do understand the potential nexus between Iraq, bioweapons and a willing proxy to use them*. For sure the US has many enemies.
Touched! And notice how no one in the EU blinked nor blanched when we stepped into The Balkans conflict; in their own backyard but why make a fuss when the global cops will pay the lions share of that tab.
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Lazy8
![Lazy8 Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/23094.jpg)
Location: The Gallatin Valley of Montana Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Nov 30, 2010 - 3:40pm |
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cc_rider wrote:The Soviets suffered incredible losses in WWII, in total numbers and per capita: one of the highest deaths per capita in the entire war. Whether the U.S. could actually have done anything to reduce those losses is subject to debate, given the timeline you list (thank you.)
But it remains that some Russians, and some British for that matter, still think the U.S. should have acted sooner and more aggressively to meet the Nazi threat. Is it a rational thought? Maybe not, but when your country sacrificed more than 25 million people defending itself, well, you might hold a grudge.
I got the gist of this historical tidbit when I visited East Berlin, a few years before reunification. Our tour guides made the Soviet position quite clear on the issue.
Getting back to your original point, yes the US us damned if we do and damned if we don't. The fact that the 20 million or so that died in the USSR (mostly as a result of Stalin's policies, not at the hands of the Germans) during a war the USSR helped start can be spun as the US' fault is a good example.
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hobiejoe
![hobiejoe Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/22188.jpg)
Location: Still in the tunnel, looking for the light. Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Nov 30, 2010 - 3:39pm |
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ndg wrote:This sucks ![{#Ass} {#Ass}](scripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/img/icon_ass.gif) Hiya P, I'm surprised you think that. I think that the debate, involving some very passionate people and a contentious issue, has been remarkably civilised. So far, and long may it continue.
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cc_rider
![cc_rider Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/41446-1383753621.jpg)
Location: Bastrop Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Nov 30, 2010 - 3:10pm |
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Lazy8 wrote: cc_rider wrote:To this day, Russia STILL holds a grudge against the U.S. for its late entry into WWII (while we're on the subject of WWII.)
Err...before June of 1941 Russia (the Soviet Union at the time) was an ally of Germany, with whom they had just finished carving up Poland. US lend-lease shipments to the USSR started that month, and a US declaration of war came five months later. If we had entered the war six months earlier we'd have been fighting the Russians. Not sure where this historical tidbit came from, but it doesn't make much sense. The Soviets suffered incredible losses in WWII, in total numbers and per capita: one of the highest deaths per capita in the entire war. Whether the U.S. could actually have done anything to reduce those losses is subject to debate, given the timeline you list (thank you.) But it remains that some Russians, and some British for that matter, still think the U.S. should have acted sooner and more aggressively to meet the Nazi threat. Is it a rational thought? Maybe not, but when your country sacrificed more than 25 million people defending itself, well, you might hold a grudge. I got the gist of this historical tidbit when I visited East Berlin, a few years before reunification. Our tour guides made the Soviet position quite clear on the issue.
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musik_knut
![musik_knut Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/44453.gif)
Location: Third Stone From The Sun Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Nov 30, 2010 - 2:50pm |
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geordiezimmerman wrote: That still doesn't justify arresting loads of muslims presuming they are guilty though does it? If there is strong evidence that they are terrorists then fine, arrest them and bring them to trial as quickly as possible. Some of these people have been in there for friggin years and many of them will be innocent. You can't be a supporter of those methods surely? nHow long does this take to prove one way or another? Oh, they're Muslim so they must be guilty right?
Some of the Muslims in Gitmo were wanted radicals, such as KSM. Others were picked up on a battlefield and are being detained *a long held tradition of many warring nations over time*. I do not believe them guilty simply because they are Muslim. Most of us in the US would agree with that. We are, despite the characterizations of some, a fair minded people.
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ndg
![ndg Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/37191-1585250765.png)
Gender: ![Female](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_female.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Nov 30, 2010 - 2:48pm |
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This sucks
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musik_knut
![musik_knut Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/44453.gif)
Location: Third Stone From The Sun Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Nov 30, 2010 - 2:48pm |
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geordiezimmerman wrote: I think it's fair to say while the U.S does try and play global cop, more none US citizens do look at how your system works than US citizens look at how other systems work, they try and work out why the US thinks it has the right to behave this way. I have the same opinion of the UK too when it joins forces with the US to occupy these countries, i don't think it's right. When you play global cop the more enemies you are going to get, that can't be good.
Of course the US plays global cop and sometimes justifably so. We are big enough to do what most others cannot do or will not do *logistically, materially and so on*. But there are many in the US, self included, who wonder why the cop role so often? For what it's worth, we had no business playing cop in Viet Nam *one of our greatest Generals, MacArthur, warned us not to get bogged down in a land war in Asia and of course, we did not learn from the lesson the French learned in Viet Nam*, nor did we have reason to enter Iraq *they were well contained and I do understand the potential nexus between Iraq, bioweapons and a willing proxy to use them*. For sure the US has many enemies.
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geordiezimmerman
![geordiezimmerman Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/44066-1333120865.jpg)
Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Nov 30, 2010 - 1:57pm |
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musik_knut wrote:
The Judicial System in the US crawls. Our Constitution spells out the right to a fair and speedy trial. Speedy just never seems to make it to the starting line. In July, 2007, two full time losers entered a Connecticutt home. Before the night was over, the father had been severly beaten, the mother raped and strangled, both young daughters tied to their beds while gasoline was poured around them *they died of smoke inhalation*. Just a few weeks back, one of the losers, Steven Hayes, was finally sentenced *two weeks or so after a verdict was reached* The other loser, Joshua Komisjarvesky, will now face trial. Speedy? Hardly. But that is how our system operates. And it stinks. Of course, Mr. Hayes, who drew the death penalty, will appeal. The average elapsed time of appeal for a death sentence in the US: 12.2 years.
That still doesn't justify arresting loads of muslims presuming they are guilty though does it? If there is strong evidence that they are terrorists then fine, arrest them and bring them to trial as quickly as possible. Some of these people have been in there for friggin years and many of them will be innocent. You can't be a supporter of those methods surely? nHow long does this take to prove one way or another? Oh, they're Muslim so they must be guilty right?
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geordiezimmerman
![geordiezimmerman Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/44066-1333120865.jpg)
Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Nov 30, 2010 - 1:53pm |
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musik_knut wrote:
Poppycock, I think? I don't think most US Citizens think/believe the US has the right to play global cop. I know I've heard many fellow citizens ask why we are always going here and there. But then, you're not a US Citizen. You just rely on POPPYCOCK. Funny how others from around the world know how US Citizens think, how our systems work yadda yadda yadda. POPPYCOCK.
I think it's fair to say while the U.S does try and play global cop, more none US citizens do look at how your system works than US citizens look at how other systems work, they try and work out why the US thinks it has the right to behave this way. I have the same opinion of the UK too when it joins forces with the US to occupy these countries, i don't think it's right. When you play global cop the more enemies you are going to get, that can't be good.
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musik_knut
![musik_knut Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/44453.gif)
Location: Third Stone From The Sun Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Nov 30, 2010 - 1:48pm |
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geordiezimmerman wrote: Oh come on man, you can't just go round arresting and imprisoning people becuase you 'think' they may be guilty, that's not how justice works and you know it. Here's an example. You are in a gas station and some middle aged white dude holds up that station and shoots the cashier dead. They round up and imprison all middle aged white folk who were there, so that includes you, until a trial can be held, could be maybe 2,3 years? You think that would be fair or not?
The Judicial System in the US crawls. Our Constitution spells out the right to a fair and speedy trial. Speedy just never seems to make it to the starting line. In July, 2007, two full time losers entered a Connecticutt home. Before the night was over, the father had been severly beaten, the mother raped and strangled, both young daughters tied to their beds while gasoline was poured around them *they died of smoke inhalation*. Just a few weeks back, one of the losers, Steven Hayes, was finally sentenced *two weeks or so after a verdict was reached* The other loser, Joshua Komisjarvesky, will now face trial. Speedy? Hardly. But that is how our system operates. And it stinks. Of course, Mr. Hayes, who drew the death penalty, will appeal. The average elapsed time of appeal for a death sentence in the US: 12.2 years.
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musik_knut
![musik_knut Avatar](https://img.radioparadise.com/avatars/44453.gif)
Location: Third Stone From The Sun Gender: ![Male](graphics/icons/icon_minigender_male.gif) ![](graphics/clear.gif)
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Posted:
Nov 30, 2010 - 1:38pm |
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geordiezimmerman wrote: I disagree with you here. You are not damned if you don't, not always and when you are it's often by the U.S citizens thinking they have this right to go in and be policeman of the world. Also, the places you may go and 'help' out always seem to be places that you can gain something from, i.e oil. It's a sort of payback, we come and help you but we then own that stuff you got. You don't see much help being offered to the folks in Africa who are often slaughtered in their thousands by corrupt governments. Just look at Zimbabwe in recent years? Not much help being done there is there? I think this is where people have a problem, not just with the U.S but here in the UK too. We only seem to head off to help people in those places where we may gain something back, so it's not for some moral reasons like it tries to be reported. I just think people are waking up to the fact sometimes you have to let some people sort their own shit out and sometimes people need to intervene but when to intervene should be based on reasons beyond what's in it for them.
Poppycock, I think? I don't think most US Citizens think/believe the US has the right to play global cop. I know I've heard many fellow citizens ask why we are always going here and there. But then, you're not a US Citizen. You just rely on POPPYCOCK. Funny how others from around the world know how US Citizens think, how our systems work yadda yadda yadda. POPPYCOCK.
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