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ScottFromWyoming

ScottFromWyoming Avatar

Location: Powell
Gender: Male


Posted: Feb 17, 2009 - 10:59am

 hobiejoe wrote:
Whole Atlantic, North to South, East to West, and top to who knows how far down, so what are the chances....
 
 

Nuclear submarines collide in Atlantic

Damaged British and French vessels return to base after crash deep below ocean's surface


 
It's going around:

Russian and US satellites collide

Iridium spacecraft (Iridium)
Iridium spacecraft provide satellite phone services

US and Russian communications satellites have collided in space in what is thought to be the biggest incident of its kind to date.

The US commercial Iridium spacecraft hit a defunct Russian satellite at an altitude of about 800km (500 miles) over Siberia on Tuesday, Nasa said.

 

Painted_Turtle

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Location: Land of Laughing Waters
Gender: Female


Posted: Feb 17, 2009 - 10:40am

An entire Mexican Island has gone "missing". 

Mexican senators said in a statement that "a force of nature (able to sink an island) does not take place without anyone noticing, and much less so when it is sitting in an area with more than 22 billion barrels of oil reserves."

from Space Wire

 
Missing Mexican island fuels mystery

 



not-a-fish

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Location: Stumptown
Gender: Female


Posted: Feb 17, 2009 - 9:55am

 geoff_morphini wrote:

Who stole it from "American Graffiti"
 

I knew someday you would screw up!  All I had to do was wait...now what did you do exactly? {#Ask}
Painted_Turtle

Painted_Turtle Avatar

Location: Land of Laughing Waters
Gender: Female


Posted: Feb 17, 2009 - 9:55am

 cc_rider wrote:

Help me out here. These things are supposed to be some of the most sophisticated machines on the planet. They have sonar, radar, who-knows-what-else on board. They can track ships hundreds of miles away. They carry, and are designed to launch, the world's most devastating weapons. Oh yeah, they are also HUGE. So...

How in blazes do they not SEE each other? It's beyond ridiculous.

c.
 
Its pretty weird alright.  I heard an interview on NPR about it.  Seems neither sub even knew they'd collided until they reached port.  Amazing.  The interviewer said that usually nuc subs turn their radar off & set their speed to very low, creating very little noise so as to avoid detection.

Sounds like they were armed to the teeth.  HMS Vanguard came into service in 1993, has a crew of around 140 and typically carries 16 Lockheed Trident D5 missiles.

France's Le Triomphant carries 111 crew and 15 nuclear missiles, according to defense analysis group Jane's.

I think the biggest threat would be leakage from the reactors and of course the loss of both of their crews like when the Russian nuc sub sank



geoff_morphini

geoff_morphini Avatar

Gender: Male


Posted: Feb 17, 2009 - 9:53am

 maryte wrote:


They stole that idea from "Footloose". 
 
Who stole it from "American Graffiti"

Lazy8

Lazy8 Avatar

Location: The Gallatin Valley of Montana
Gender: Male


Posted: Feb 17, 2009 - 9:50am

 cc_rider wrote:

Help me out here. These things are supposed to be some of the most sophisticated machines on the planet. They have sonar, radar, who-knows-what-else on board. They can track ships hundreds of miles away. They carry, and are designed to launch, the world's most devastating weapons. Oh yeah, they are also HUGE. So...

How in blazes do they not SEE each other? It's beyond ridiculous.
 
They are, technically, underwater. Hard to see down there.

They mostly use passive sonar (listening with very good microphones) to detect other vessels. Active methods (sending out some kind of signal and looking for a reflection) make the active vessel more visible than anything it's trying to find. The whole reason they put missiles on submarines is to hide them, so they make as little noise as possible.

That said we may not be hearing the whole story. The two may have been playing tag for all we know.

phineas

phineas Avatar



Posted: Feb 17, 2009 - 9:49am

 maryte wrote:


They stole that idea from "Footloose". 
 
*snork*

maryte

maryte Avatar

Location: Blinding You With Library Science!
Gender: Female


Posted: Feb 17, 2009 - 9:48am

 phineas wrote:

I figure they "saw" each other and each was too obstinate to turn.
 

They stole that idea from "Footloose". 

phineas

phineas Avatar



Posted: Feb 17, 2009 - 9:47am

 cc_rider wrote:

Help me out here. These things are supposed to be some of the most sophisticated machines on the planet. They have sonar, radar, who-knows-what-else on board. They can track ships hundreds of miles away. They carry, and are designed to launch, the world's most devastating weapons. Oh yeah, they are also HUGE. So...

How in blazes do they not SEE each other? It's beyond ridiculous.

c.
 
I figure they "saw" each other and each was too obstinate to turn.

cc_rider

cc_rider Avatar

Location: Bastrop
Gender: Male


Posted: Feb 17, 2009 - 9:43am

 hobiejoe wrote:
Whole Atlantic, North to South, East to West, and top to who knows how far down, so what are the chances....
 
 

Nuclear submarines collide in Atlantic



 
Help me out here. These things are supposed to be some of the most sophisticated machines on the planet. They have sonar, radar, who-knows-what-else on board. They can track ships hundreds of miles away. They carry, and are designed to launch, the world's most devastating weapons. Oh yeah, they are also HUGE. So...

How in blazes do they not SEE each other? It's beyond ridiculous.

c.

hobiejoe

hobiejoe Avatar

Location: Still in the tunnel, looking for the light.
Gender: Male


Posted: Feb 16, 2009 - 4:43pm

Whole Atlantic, North to South, East to West, and top to who knows how far down, so what are the chances....
 
 

Nuclear submarines collide in Atlantic

Damaged British and French vessels return to base after crash deep below ocean's surface

HMS Vanguard

HMS Vanguard before it suffered 'scrapes' in a collision with a French submarine. Photograph: Chris Bacon/PA

A Royal Navy nuclear submarine and a French vessel have been damaged in a collision deep below the surface of the Atlantic Ocean.

HMS Vanguard and Le Triomphant, which were carrying nuclear missiles on routine patrols, are reported to have collided while submerged on 3 or 4 February. Between them they had about 250 sailors on board.

The Ministry of Defence initially refused to confirm the incident, saying it was not policy to comment on submarine operations. This afternoon the First Sea Lord, Admiral Sir Jonathon Band, issued a statement saying the two vessels hit each other while travelling at very low speeds and no one was injured.

"We can confirm that the capability remained unaffected and there has been no compromise to nuclear safety," he said. The MoD said the Vanguard returned to its base in Faslane, Scotland, with only "scrapes".

Defence officials told guardian.co.uk the two submarines collided in what they said was an extraordinary accident. "They can't see each other in the water," one official said, raising questions about the submarines' sonar and why they did not detect one another.

Opposition parties asked how the accident was possible. The SNP's Westminster leader, Angus Robertson, said: "The UK Ministry of Defence needs to explain how it is possible for a submarine carrying weapons of mass destruction to collide with another submarine carrying weapons of mass destruction in the middle of the world's second-largest ocean.

"In contrast to MoD secrecy, the French military authorities publicised details of the incident on a website. The MoD cannot hide behind operational secrecy and must make a statement on this as a priority."

The shadow defence secretary, Liam Fox, called the incident "extremely worrying".

The Liberal Democrat defence spokesman, Nick Harvey, said: "While the British nuclear fleet has a good safety record, if there were ever to be a bang it would be a mighty big one. The public entrust this equipment to the government confident that all possible precautions are being taken. Now that this incident is public knowledge, the people of Britain, France and the rest of the world need to be reassured this can never happen again and that lessons are being learned."

France's defence ministry said in a brief statement on 6 February that the Triomphant had struck "a submerged object (probably a container)" during a return journey from a patrol, damaging the sonar dome on the front of the submarine.

It said no crew members were injured and the nuclear security of the submarine had not been compromised.

Today the ministry confirmed that another sub was involved, saying: "They briefly came into contact at a very low speed while submerged."

After the accident, the French submarine returned to its base on L'Ile Longue, near Brest, under its own power and escorted by a frigate.

Vanguard, one of Britain's four V-class submarines that make up the Trident nuclear deterrent, each of which is capable of carrying up to 16 missiles, was said to have visible dents on its hull as it was towed home at the weekend. Inquiries are under way on both sides of the Channel.

Kate Hudson, the Campaign for Nuclear Disarmament chairwoman, described the incident as "a nuclear ­nightmare of the highest order".

"The collision of two submarines, both with nuclear reactors and nuclear weapons on board, could have released vast amounts of radiation and scattered scores of nuclear warheads across the seabed," she said. "The dents reportedly visible on the British sub show the boats were no more than a couple of seconds away from total catastrophe."

Hudson said it was the first time since the cold war that two nuclear-armed submarines were known to have collided.

"These dangers are inherent whilst the British government maintains its 1960s policy of having at least one nuclear ­weapons submarine sailing round the Atlantic 24 hours a day, 365 days a year," she said. "HMS Vanguard is likely to be confined to port for months with a multimillion-pound repair bill. Gordon Brown should seize this opportunity to end continuous patrols."

Le Triomphant, which entered service in 1997, carries 16 nuclear missiles and is one of four nuclear-armed submarines in the French fleet.

Stephane Lhomme, a spokesman for the French anti-nuclear group Sortir du Nucleaire, said its network of activists was on alert for any signs of radioactive leaks near French shores.

"This reminds us that we could have a new catastrophe with a nuclear submarine at any moment. It is a risk that exists during missions but also in port," he said. "These are mobile nuclear reactors."



hippiechick

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Location: topsy turvy land
Gender: Female


Posted: Nov 13, 2008 - 5:36pm

 ScottFromWyoming wrote:


 
Guess he knows what he's talking about.

Coaxial

Coaxial Avatar

Location: Comfortably numb in So Texas
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 13, 2008 - 5:14pm

 ScottFromWyoming wrote:


 
Werd!{#Lol}

n4ku

n4ku Avatar

Location: --... ...--


Posted: Nov 13, 2008 - 1:29pm

 ScottFromWyoming wrote:


 


ScottFromWyoming

ScottFromWyoming Avatar

Location: Powell
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 13, 2008 - 1:26pm


hobiejoe

hobiejoe Avatar

Location: Still in the tunnel, looking for the light.
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 13, 2008 - 7:13am

With security guards like these, who needs enemies?

< end article-header >

One can only hope that whoever was responsible had the decency to say "Whoops!" Employed to protect Tony Blair on a peace mission to the Middle East, one of his minders was about to board a plane from Tel Aviv's Ben-Gurion airport, so decided to take the bullets out of their gun. You know, to be safe.

Unfortunately, the minder must have accidentally pulled the trigger because there was a loud bang and a bullet shattered on the ground. Pandemonium ensued, and the Israeli Airports Authority has launched an inquiry. On the faux-pas scale, it is quite high.

But then ever since he left office, Blair's security team have been working hard to earn themselves a reputation as world-class blunderers. In September last year, the former prime minister's new reinforced BMW had to be returned to the factory in Munich after four asylum seekers jumped out of its container on arrival in London. This was followed in May by a slight mid-air misunderstanding with the Israeli air force, who did not receive the proper identification from Blair's private jet after it entered Israel's airspace. Two fighters were scrambled, and reportedly came within seconds of shooting the plane down. A "technical error" was blamed.

Then, in September, a senior firearms officer had to be removed from operational duties when it emerged that, caught short on London's Edgware Road, she had popped into the toilet of a nearby Starbucks and left her gun behind. The alarm was raised 20 minutes later when a customer found a loaded Glock 17 semi-automatic pistol in the cubicle.

Whether Blair is losing sleep over all this, one can only imagine. But he might like to hear one consoling thought in mind: if this is what his security is like, and he is still alive, then his enemies cannot be all that brilliant either.



Lazy8

Lazy8 Avatar

Location: The Gallatin Valley of Montana
Gender: Male


Posted: Nov 13, 2008 - 7:07am

 manbirdexperiment wrote:
I have this huge fear of someday sending one of my crazy emails (which are often
copied from the 260,000 thread) to a client instead of the family member or friend
to whom it was intended. Can you imagine? I would have some splainin to do...
 
I would pay money to be in the room when that happened.

There have been times when people looking over my shoulder have followed along as I participate in that thread...to say it's hard to explain would be WAY understating it.

My kids get it, anyway. My youngest REALLY wants to meet you.

edieraye

edieraye Avatar



Posted: Nov 13, 2008 - 5:44am

What FP didn't say about the mayor of Karachi
Wed, 11/12/2008 - 5:02pm

One of my responsibilities here at Foreign Policy is manning the "FP Editor" e-mail account. It's always fun to come in in the morning and see how readers around the world are reacting to what we print. Sometimes, the reactions can be a bit strange, though.

Yesterday, we started receiving e-mails from readers and journalists in Pakistan asking for comment on reports that we had named Karachi's mayor, Mustafa Kamal, "the second best mayor in the world." This would be an understandable query if we had actually said anything of the sort.

At issue is a sidebar from FP's recent Global Cities Index that names Kamal, Berlin's Klaus Wowereit, and Chongqing's Wang Hongju as "mayors of the moment" who have found innovative ways to globalize their cities. The mayors are not ranked, nor are we implying that they are objectively "better" than any other mayors, but that didn't stop the Karachi city government from issuing a press release on its Web site (they've changed the text since being contacted by FP) congratulating Kamal for being the No. 2 mayor in the world. For the record, the three names are not listed in any particular order.

Pakistan's biggest English-language newspaper, Dawn, then printed a glorified transcription of the mayor's press release by the government-controlled Associated Press of Pakistan as a front-page story without ever checking with us to see if it was accurate.

According to the e-mails we've received, the inaccurate story has been widely reported on Pakistani TV, radio, and blogs. Most absurdly, Karachi's city council apparently held a heated debate over whether to pass a resolution congratulating Kamal for the honor we allegedly bestowed on him. Judging by today's e-mails, the efforts of some blogs to correct the story only seem to have confused readers more.

According to one reporter, who unlike Dawn contacted us for comment, "Karachi is riddled with banners by the local government, congratulating Mr. Kamal for being declared as second best mayor of the world by the Foreign Policy."

We hate to rain on Kamal's parade, and certainly intend him and his city no disrespect, but we simply never ranked him in any way. This entire mess could have been avoided with some very basic fact-checking.


Manbird

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Location: ? ? ?
Gender: Male


Posted: Jan 16, 2008 - 10:58pm

ScottFromWyoming

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Location: Powell
Gender: Male


Posted: Jan 16, 2008 - 10:00pm

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